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Meeks
Starting Member
Australia
5 posts
Joined: Sep, 2004
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 Posted - 2004/09/25 : 05:27:20
This thread is intended as a place to track progress in producing a happy hardcore track. It should be useful in terms of getting things done, since if I say I'm going to do something and don't get it done, there'll be witnesses...
You're welcome to add your own entries to this thread to help you stick with your own productions too.
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Meeks
Starting Member
Australia
5 posts
Joined: Sep, 2004
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Posted - 2004/09/25 : 06:06:37
25 Sept 04
I figure there's several places I might like to start:
* The style
* The arrangement
* The samples
* The chords
The plan for today is to work out the arrangement. In the past I've stalled by focusing on just a loop, or not thinking beyond a phrase. I'm using the following tracks for reference, and will deconstruct them on a piece of paper, mapping out every phrase and what it's doing:
Desired State - Dance the Dream (Slammin Vinyl remix)
DJ Uplift - Brutal
Scooter - Endless Summer
Ham & DNA - About U
I heard a good piece of advice from some producers about charting the "intensity" of a track on paper, so you know when you want it to build tension or drop it...I might try and incorporate this into the planning.
They'll also do for style influences - 4/4 kickdrums, oldskool stabs (in the case of Dance the Dream and Brutal), pianos (all of them) etc. I'd also like to get some Endless Summer style acid in there, because I think the track does a really good job of using it effectively in a fast 4-to-the-floor context. Unfortunately, they're all rather good tracks IMO, so to measure up to them I've set the bar rather high.
I figure that what I can do with the arrangement is highly dependent on what samples I choose to use, particularly the human stuff - rap snippets, spoken samples, or vocals. For this first project I think I'll leave out vocals, and stick to rap snippets and spoken samples, and maybe incorporate small vocal scat snippets for texture. I've built up a collection of such rap and vocal snippets in the past, and will restrict myself to just using these already cropped samples.
If I have time left over, I'll attempt to work out a chord progression for use in the track. I've already decided that the track will be in minor, so I'll be using chords associated with the minor scale. The chord progression is to be used with an ambient pad, strings or choir patch in the background, and should form the foundation of the track (apart from the arrangement). I know a lot of producers start with percussion, but I'd rather get the harmony stuff out of the way, and then follow with bassline (if it's not going to be offbeat stabs), then the hooks...percussion last. I don't know if this approach is going to be practical, but it'll do for now, and I can add "guide" percussion as I go, I guess.
Okay, now off to find a pen and scrapbook and analyse/map out those arrangements...
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Edited by - Meeks on 2004/09/25 09:13:23 |
Triquatra
Moderator
United Kingdom
12,635 posts
Joined: Nov, 2003
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Posted - 2004/09/25 : 08:22:07
good lord, do i detect a thread that might actually be useful! 
looking forward to seeing how it progresses meeks - and im sure alot of other people are too!
http://www.dj-triquatra.com
The pen is mightier than the sword you claim.
Very well, get out your pens essay writers and prepare to have your logic tested by steel.
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JeremyC
New Member
United States
43 posts
Joined: Jul, 2004
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Posted - 2004/09/25 : 20:45:33
yeah, please keep us at up to date as possible. Obviously we don't want you to waste inspiration trying to let us know what's going on, but please let us know. I want to get started on producing, but I have so little knowledge of the details that I would love to hear someone else's ideas first, especially in a step by step set up
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Meeks
Starting Member
Australia
5 posts
Joined: Sep, 2004
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Posted - 2004/09/26 : 07:37:04
Cheers for the interest guys. :) I doubt any inspiration is going to waste as I wasn't getting anywhere before, whereas this thread has already provided a lot of forward momentum.
26 Sept 04
Between yesterday and today I've mapped out the arrangements to the tracks - with the exception of Ham & DNA - About U, which I've replaced with DJ Ham - Remembering The Time (because I couldn't find my copy in time....and I think it actually turned out for the best in the end).
Comments on the arrangements:
Dance the Dream (Slammin Vinyl remix): By far the most complex arrangement of the lot, with the most ideas going on. There's hardly a phrase where something doesn't drop in or drop out, and no less than four hands-in-the-air "drops", complete with crowd sounds, whoops, vocals and rave horns. Despite being an update of an oldskool track to mid-nineties happy hardcore, it still shows it's oldskool heritage to a large degree....the amount of changes in the percussion (two different breakbeats sometimes in solo, kicks coming in and out) might be dangerous on a clubby dancefloor (not that happy hardcore is for the squeamish, but anyway). The remix is about 29 phrases long.
Brutal: Despite being a wicked track, it struck me as a somewhat confused arrangement. It starts off well, and the orch stab stuff at the start and the piano both hit like a tonne of bricks, and then around about the point where Luna-C mixes out of the track in his Supaset, it seems to lose direction...like the phrase of just whoop samples and another one of odd FX which are obviously both there for relief from the piano riffage, but seem to serve little other purpose. In it's favour, it features a long DJ-friendly outro, which probably led to it being the longest arrangement I analysed, at 35 phrases long.
Endless Summer: A really short arrangement compared to the others, at only around 15 phrases in length (perhaps a radio edit). Sort of goes Pads for a phrase or two -> Piano on it's own -> (First drop) Kicks, piano -> (First breakdown) Acid on it's own -> Acid with kicks -> -> Kicks, piano, vox for 3 phrases -> (Second breakdown) Breakbeat phrase, no kicks -> Piano + vox, no kicks -> (Second drop) Kicks, piano + vox for 3 phrases, end. Fits a lot in in a small space, and is quite balanced. Again, probably wouldn't work in a club because it never really settles into a groove - it seems to be mostly about going on the attack....like you'd expect a top 40 pop single might.
Remembering the Time: Definitely the most typical "Raver Baby-ish" arrangement of the ones I've analysed, it seems to follow a tried-and-true trance formula, going roughly:
intro and kickdrum groove -> breakdown -> vox with breakdown -> (first hook) lead trance arp -> lead trance arp build with vox -> (first drop) kickdrum groove with trance lead arp for phrase or two -> descending trance arp -> Middle 8 with kicks -> middle 8 with kicks & claps -> More insistent middle 8 for 2 phrases -> middle 8 descends -> (second hook) Lead trance arp with no kicks -> lead trance arp build with vox -> (second drop) lead arp with kicks for 2 phrases -> lead arp with kicks & vox descending for 2 phrases -> kickdrum groove with offbeat stabs outro.
Because "Remembering the Time"'s arrangement seems so familiar and so tried-and-true, I've decided to copy it as the basis for my own arrangement. To this end, I've opened up Reason and created group blocks of each colour Reason is capable of (a total of 8 colours so far as I can see) and painted them in as a guide. The colors stand for:
White: Intro/outro kickdrum groove.
Brown: Initial breakdown.
Blue: Lead hook.
Grey: Lead hook with build.
Dark Green: Lead hook with kickdrum groove.
Light Green: Altered lead hook with kickdrum groove.
Yellow: Middle 8 "light"
Lime: Middle 8 "more insistent"
Red: Middle 8 "reminiscent of the altered lead"
The "Remembering the Time" arrangement probably won't be my final arrangement, but serves as an excellent starting point, and I need my training wheels at the moment...now I've got my 28 phrase arrangement laid out, it appears to be only a matter of filling in the blanks.
The next step I think is to create my lead hook, as it's the central focus of the track in "Remembering The Time", and can be used as a basis for the breakdowns and middle 8. I'll use a combination of energyXT and Renoise to create this hook. I'll also see if I can find a vocal which can fit over it (possibly renegging on the earlier promise not to use a vocal - finding it hard to think outside the box here) because they'll need to be in the same key...or failing that, a rap snippet to go with it.
So my arrangement has led to the next goal I've set for myself, which is a lead hook with a complementary vox sample.
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Edited by - Meeks on 2004/09/26 07:38:30 |
DJ Superman
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
1,192 posts
Joined: Jul, 2003
46 hardcore releases
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Posted - 2004/09/26 : 11:51:34
interesting stuff mate, this'll give new producers some ideas and force you to keep us updated!
keep at it, looking forward to seeing the finished product
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whizz-billy-the-kid's got you in his sights
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whizz-billy-the-kid's got you in his sights
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Underloop
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
3,895 posts
Joined: Mar, 2002
91 hardcore releases
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Posted - 2004/09/27 : 14:26:19
Fantastic idea! Tutorials are all very well and good, but actually seeing a WIP (work in progress) as it ermmmm progresses is invaluable!
Matthew aka DJ Underloop
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"We don't stop playing because we grow old;
we grow old because we stop playing."
- George Bernard Shaw
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Meeks
Starting Member
Australia
5 posts
Joined: Sep, 2004
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Posted - 2004/09/27 : 15:54:22
No worries, and thanks for the encouragement guys. :)
27 Sept 04
Didn't have much time to spend on it tonight, but regardless I've figured out a couple of candidate chord sequences heavy on the inversions (which will probably later get converted into some sort of arp if I use one) and nailed the lead patch options down to 4 thick tones in the sampler. Needs more work though, and I really don't want to compromise on this bit of the track, so will keep at it. Also haven't investigated a suitable vocal companion to it yet - forgot about that! I guess this is a benefit of writing stuff down...anyways, back at it tomorrow night.
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Edited by - Meeks on 2004/09/27 15:57:34 |
The Deviant
Senior Member
United Kingdom
329 posts
Joined: May, 2004
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Posted - 2004/09/28 : 20:08:17
This is interesting and will hopefully help me get inspired and motavated so i can finish my tune.
I have a few questions though.
How long is a phrase, is it a block of 8 bars?
And how did you make parts the same colour in reason. When I group midi data, reason just give's it a random colour.
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Meeks
Starting Member
Australia
5 posts
Joined: Sep, 2004
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Posted - 2004/09/29 : 09:48:50
quote:
How long is a phrase, is it a block of 8 bars?
Spot on.
quote:
And how did you make parts the same colour in reason. When I group midi data, reason just give's it a random colour.
I did a sort of awkward workaround. :) I loaded up a sampler (with the amp volume turned down to 0) and painted random notes and watched the colours change until I had a groups of each of the 8 colours, then copied the coloured groups to the positions I wanted on another track to serve as a sort of map. This guide track isn't going to make any sound, and the coloured groups won't get used to play anything - it's just a visual aid to help me remember my arrangement.
quote:
This is interesting and will hopefully help me get inspired and motavated so i can finish my tune.
Good luck man, please let us know how you're going. I've been slowed down a bit doing my tax return (real life intruding again), but will be back into it soon.
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The Deviant
Senior Member
United Kingdom
329 posts
Joined: May, 2004
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Posted - 2004/09/30 : 14:20:14
Damm! I hope this gets changed in the next version of reason.
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dj mull
Average Member
Ireland
163 posts
Joined: Feb, 2004
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Posted - 2004/10/02 : 13:39:24
This is an excellent topic. its proving very usefull for me. good idea meeks!!
martin mullen
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martin mullen
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